JC / Railbird

How about the family angle?
It seems to work fairly well on special days at Turf Paradise.
I also made my first trip to Monmouth in 14 years recently and there were more people in the new picnic area than I ever saw at the track during Holy Bull’s heydey.
Removing the stigma of the sleazy down on his luck gambler is the first step down that road.

Posted by Chris on September 5, 2008 @ 1:08 pm

And we think McNair (washed-up owner/breeder) and Sabini (washed-up politician) know what they’re talking about because … ?
Actually, the experience of going to the track is very different from the experience of attending most sporting events. There are thirty-minute intervals during which nothing much happens, interrupted by one or two minutes of activity. Many, if not most, of the people at the track watch the event on a monitor or big-screen, not live, and they wouldn’t know what was happening without an announcer to tell them. Few of the people at the track have ever actually participated in the sport they are watching. The appeal of the track is the opportunity for family and social interactions and, yes, for gambling.
I think racing makes a big mistake if it focuses on trying to grow back to what it once was, as opposed to trying to preserve a niche that it can serve well in changed circumstances. My take on Sabini and his emphasis on attendance is that he is laying the groundwork for arguing that, because horse racing is not very popular, more slots money should be shifted away from purses and into the public coffers.

Posted by BitPlayer on September 5, 2008 @ 2:50 pm

[What BitPlayer said.]
With one addition:
Sabini (washed-up politician and self-described “very casual horseplayer” appointed to cushy $120,800-per-year post so as to avoid messy intra-party primary fight)

Posted by alan on September 5, 2008 @ 3:22 pm

I’m skeptical, and that could be because I’m not a sports fan, I’m a racing fan, and there are big differences between going to a baseball game and spending a day at the track, not least that I can wager and the game is interactive. I find it curious that “sports fans” are cropping up in relation to marketing racing lately, because the emphasis skips over the most interesting thing about racing and it doesn’t address turning those fans into bettors, which are — despite McNair’s apparent distaste — essential to racing’s future.
Family is a good angle, as would be marketing racing as entertainment.
Have to love state politics, right?

Posted by Jessica on September 5, 2008 @ 3:36 pm

“The challenge of promoting racing is that it’s both sport and game, and the game is what fuels the sport.”
“Removing the stigma of the sleazy down on his luck gambler is the first step down that road.”
“Actually, the experience of going to the track is very different from the experience of attending most sporting events.”
Great points by all, and I think they feed into a greater point: Nobody is marketing the entire experience right now — at least not that I’ve seen.
Brainstorming how to solve that problem is a challenge akin to handicapping a maiden turf sprint, but we definitely need to keep talking about it …

Posted by Pete on September 5, 2008 @ 3:40 pm

See NTRA’s current efforts:
“Go Baby Go” — yeah, that captures the feeling we get when they turn for home, but by my estimate, it’s short-sighted, since that comprises about 15 minutes of a day at the track. In my opinion, it’s such a powerful moment mainly because it is the exciting climax of a series of events that have built up an incredible feeling of anticipation — scrutinizing the form to find that one angle that everyone else will surely overlook, locking eyes with the horse in the paddock, watching your favorite jockey fearlessly and confidently climb aboard, trembling with excitement when you place your wager, etc.
NTRA U. — while educational and helpful, it primarily focuses on wagering/handicapping. Ask Virtual Q & A what a stalker is, and she ignores the question.
NTRA facebook page — that Del Mar video makes me want to jet out to San Diego with my buddies a la Entourage, but umm, if I took my friends to our local track, Finger Lakes, after showing them that video, they’d be disappointed. Besides, small “racinos” like Finger Lakes have to rely on the slots in their marketing, unfortunately.
So how do we connect all the dots and put it together, and where do we do it?

Posted by Pete on September 5, 2008 @ 3:53 pm

http://twitter.com/raceday360/statuses/911134998
Thanks for the heads up. Brings about another marketing problem — the sport provides gripping stories for people to latch onto one day a year: Derby Day. If we did hook anybody who saw an inspirational story leading up to the race that day, how are they going to react when their new favorite horse is gone at the end of his 3YO campaign? Or like War Pass, when they don’t even make it through their 3YO season and are retired to stud?
We’ll keep coming back and falling for it over and over because we have a passion for the game, but I don’t know if they will. And when something like Curlin comes along nowadays, it ends up feeling like that moment in your dream when you’re making out with someone you’ve always liked but you realize it’s only a dream, and there’s a few hazy seconds where you hold on to that great feeling even though you know it could evaporate any second, and then usually it does. Yeah, I think it’s like that.

Posted by Pete on September 5, 2008 @ 5:00 pm

I hope Dana chimes in on that last point, because early retirement is a topic to which she’s given much though … it is a problem, losing elite horses after abbreviated careers. Hard Spun is a great example of a horse who built a fan base as a 3-year-old and looked like a potential 4-year-old superstar on track. But he was retired at the end of 2007 and all that was lost … even former owner Rick Porter expressed some regret at the development.

Posted by Jessica on September 5, 2008 @ 5:28 pm

Count me among those who joined Hard Spun’s fan base. After performing in all the Triple Crown races, I was sold on the “iron horse” idea and definitely bought into the concept of Hard Spun as a 4YO star.
He was my Classic horse — at least I bet him to place that day and didn’t succumb to my usual bungling of the when to back up/when not to back up scenario, as noted here: http://tinyurl.com/5dsko4
Still disappointed he didn’t come back.

Posted by Pete on September 5, 2008 @ 6:01 pm

I’m also disappointed that Hard Spun didn’t come back, but as a *sports* fan these things happen. If you’re a ChiSox fan this afternoon it may seem your season is over after likely MVP Carlos Quentin is done for the season. So do you sell your tickets, stop watching, etc? I really think the early retirement thing is WAY overblown.
I think growing the game through attendance is key. Getting people to the track exposes them to something they can’t get on teevee, the interwebs etc. THE LOVE comes from seeing it live in a classic setting — a BC event, a TC event, and afternoon at Saratoga, SA etc. Get people to that experience (if CS is improved) and people will stay — sports fans particularly.
I think that NASCAR and golf — with the new cup for NASCAR and the FedEx cup are both interesting ways that horse racing can integrate some sort of overall, over-arching season to give the spring through fall game a type of cohesion that could prove interesting. Not a win and you’re in … but an arcane points system no-one understands but follows anyway. Everyone likes lists these days.

Posted by o_crunk on September 5, 2008 @ 6:23 pm

Being an out going sport playing ego driven person whom is now laid up…..This game found me…Its not so much the majesty of the game….Its the I can be the game aspect I love….It hooked me instantly….My wife would ask” who won….And she finally understands I don’t care just as long as I won…..
This is an awesome outlet for me…Now being disabled I can still compete…Those juices still flow thru my veins…Horse Racing is the outlet….But it also lets me use my brain as well……..
Its not just gambling…Its being in the game being part of the action….
If Football and Baseball can sell fantasy leagues…Horse Racing can be sold as well….People flock to the Fantasy leagues to feel like they are in the game…..In Horse Racing the Handicapper Is In the game…..Now the Sport just needs to embrace the Handicapper / Fan base and grow from there..
Hey the game hooked me…If it can do that it can hook any one……
I think O crunk last paragraph makes a lot of sense.

Posted by pete on September 5, 2008 @ 7:19 pm

Would huge races broadcast during halftime of major sporting events (Lions on Thanksgiving, Super Bowl, Knicks on Christmas day, etc) help draw sports fans?
Not sure if this is doable, but I haven’t heard the idea tossed about. Racing would have to change its schedule a bit, but the reward would be worth it.
Marketing feast.

Posted by Ernie on September 5, 2008 @ 7:25 pm

Wow, great conversation! One that I think points out what is often missed… there are multiple ways to connect with racing, and it should be marketed that way.
I think it’s a huge mistake to try to “sanitize” racing as a sports only event and agree with Bit Player that the experience of going to the track is a different animal from a ball game all together, and should be treated as such.
However, I think there are sports fan-ish areas of appeal, such as competition (both between the horses, jocks, trainers & and ourselves as we wager) and the appeal of athletes (horses and jocks). There are certainly plenty of ways these angles could be marketed.
I don’t think the early retirement issue is a 1 to 1 to with “athletes get injured”. Sure, a case like War Pass is more akin to that but the case of Hard Spun (or fill-in the blank talented 3yo that didn’t retire with an injury) is more along the lines of Micheal Jordan only playing 2 seasons and then retiring because he can make more money hawking sneakers. It makes fan retention tough because it immediately truncates the fan angle.
I agree whole heartedly that getting people to the track is key, but showing them HOW to enjoy racing is important too. Not just how place an exacta box wager but the rhythm of the whole event… go to the paddock, watch parade. If all else fails beer drinking and people watching are fun too. I think the most enticing thing about my very first day at the track was that it was this whole universe that I never knew existed.
All these angles (and more!) can be “marketed to”… it doesn’t have to be one or the other. At least that’s that I think.

Posted by dana on September 5, 2008 @ 8:30 pm

Why are certain unalterable facts always ignored when marketing/advertising Thoroughbred racing is discussed? a) without the ability to gamble, no one would go to a racetrack; b) people by the thousands sit in from of slot machines, virtually in a comatose state, preferring to do such instead of going to a far more exciting place – the racetrack. Why?
The first fact above is indisputable. Now, the second. Could it be that the thousands of slot players simply are unaware of what racing offers? Isn’t ‘action’ very fast now with simulcating? Don’t gambling options (pick threes, pick fours, et cetera) pay huge at times?
Racing is not marketed as an option to casino gambling; it is not marketed period! Racing also is not a family oriented venue; didn’t Las Vegas try the family approach a few years ago?
Start informing the unknowing as to what racing offers: a gambling environment superior to any other, and they will come. It is unfathomable that mechanical slot machines are found to be more interesting than horses coming down the stretch.
It seems that racing hasn’t gotten any traction of late because everyone keeps referring to it as a sport; when racing is clearly all about having a nice time in a gambling environment.

Posted by wmcorrow on September 6, 2008 @ 9:37 am

Can we agree that, like the NHL, there are too many teams(tracks)?
In addition to all the above points, which are very good.
1)Shorten the season.
2)Restrict breeding to 5yo+.
3)Have the tracks sponsor and giveaway a 1% (or whatever) partnership interest for one year. Every Saturday.
4)For the mindless drones that like to pull on cranks:
A)Provide the best class sports book you can afford with all the perks to go with it.
B)Why not give a $2 voucher on the favorite in a random race for every 10 pulls of the bandit?

Posted by winston on September 7, 2008 @ 9:37 am

Get rid of the horse racing stigmas would be a good start. People (more than I think) unfamiliar with racing believe races to be fixed (why handicapp then) and that horses are abused(not tolerable). Also with all the money involved in racing why don’t the major players take care of their own,the feel is horses are thrown away and backside workers are a lower life form.

Posted by libby on September 7, 2008 @ 10:12 am

Did someone really refer to McNair as a washed up owner and breeder?
Man, it’s those kinds of comments that make an otherwise good discussion lose all credibility.
The guy was in the game for 15 years and built one of the most impressive broodmare bands in all the sport. Some people go a lifetime without getting the results he got, and he did it the old fashioned way: acquiring stock, racing it, and breeding it. It was rare that he’d cherry pick (though he did: Sort It Out, etc.).
Stonerside is an example of how to be successful in the breeding and racing game.

Posted by EJXD2 on September 7, 2008 @ 3:27 pm

I agree with EJXD2 — What is the value in taking potshots at McNair?
With all due respect, racing has no idea what it’s doing (I think we might be in agreement on that). It’s scared or embarrassed to aggressively market itself as a gambling game. Hello? It’s the greatest gambling game. It’s scared to challenge people to actually learn how to play while at the same time letting them know the incredible reward for being smart (and lucky) enough to hit, say, the Del Mar Pick 6.
Please, somebody, give me the television advertising budget and I promise to show you how it’s done.
What racing has been very good at projecting is how much trouble it’s in, how marginalized it has become …
I’ve got no problem with going after sports fans, but they should not be the prime target audience. Build events like the Triple Crown and they will pay attention. Have a day like the Haskell and the families will turn out in force. Develop an event that engenders pride, like the Maryland Million, and all the rich farm people, who talk the talk (but are NEVER at the racetrack), will finally show up. But the game, the day in, day out game, must be marketed to people who like action, people who like to bet, the cerebral well-to-do. The $2 shlub must never be treated like garbage (see Gulfstream) because every player is a worthwhile player; every character adds character. But there is a world of people out there untapped by racing. It is a game for fetishists, but the game’s leaders don’t actively pursue those who would be predisposed to falling down the fascinating rabbit hole of pedigree. It is a game for strategists, but what effort do they put in to illuminating for, say, poker players (not slots players) the parimutuel me-against-the-world battle? Racing must sell the thrill of its war. The handicapping contests are excellent, but they are marketed to the already converted. Significant money is going to have to be spent to pierce the bubble and spread to a larger public. Start with outsiders with fresh perspective on what might be going wrong. Enough of the corporate men, whose suits or family histories or managerial competence lead to the assumption they are entitled to lead racing into what is turning out to be its most critical juncture. It’s time for the brash and the bold to take over. Their mission? Maintain historical continuity. Do not alienate existing players and fans. Sell the great facets of racing to untapped audiences that await their discovery. Oh, and do something about that Ladies Classic. — John S.

Posted by John S. on September 7, 2008 @ 9:19 pm

John is spot on.
This is a gambling game, and any notion to the contrary–that it could appeal to people as a mainstream sport–is pure folly.
People illegally wager billions a year on football, and much of that has to do with simple betting propositions related to every game: you either pick who will win or you pick how many points the teams will score in a game.
These wagers are illegal everywhere but Nevada, but they happen at a staggering rate. Betting on horse racing is LEGAL online or over the phone in many jurisdictions but you never see the ADW companies advertising during racing. Why?
The Super Bowl handles billions. The Kentucky Derby handles $100-million plus, which isn’t too shabby either. Imagine what that figure would be if people who liked to gamble knew they could go online and put $50 to win on a horse that looks interesting. Maybe they like it and bet the Preakness and it snowballs from there.
Fans are important–someone has to pay $200 to sit in a Breeders’ Cup seat–but this game will only survive with more owners and more gamblers.

Posted by EJXD2 on September 7, 2008 @ 11:40 pm

Here’s an idea: Breeders and owners contribute money every year, in fees, to become eligible for the Breeders’ Cup. I may be mistaken, but I believe very few don’t pay. Why not create the same kind of funding mechanism for marketing the game? It also could be developed on a sliding scale, so those who love the game, but are at the bottom, pay one rate, and those titanically rich pay one higher. If you’ve got $1.6 million to buy an A.P. Indy yearling, you probably have the money to support a marketing campaign. And it can’t be “Go, Baby, Go!” Racing can’t be wasting its time throwing out a net trying to catch every fish in the sea. Cultivating 10 new 100-grand-a-year players is far more valuable than attracting 50 families who might picnic by the rail on a spring day. Admit what you are, be proud of it, and start selling your strengths. Now.

Posted by John S. on September 8, 2008 @ 12:12 pm

one more thing and I’ll shut up (for a second)…
Pete is on to something talking about the fantasy leagues people flock to for football and baseball. Racing has fantasy stables, but they are TOTALLY worthless. THE GAME IS ALREADY IN PLACE. Fantasy leagues for baseball and football took off because they fulfilled a fan’s desire to be put into a decision-making role; the leagues create an environment for competitive fans to show they know more about the game than anyone else. They reward ego and vanity and they do it with money.
Kind of reminds me of every single parimutuel race run in America!
So, there is your audience right there ripe for exposure.
Market like this: Why play fantasy when you can play reality?
Or, here’s a good slogan (with a nod to the old King Leatherbury stakes horse): “I am the game!”
(p.s. — By the time you read this, I will have copyrighted these slogans)

Posted by John S. on September 8, 2008 @ 12:40 pm

All I can say is that I hope you’ll all considering entering.

Posted by dana on September 8, 2008 @ 8:06 pm

Fantasy leagues for baseball and football took off because they fulfilled a fan’s desire to be put into a decision-making role…
Fans have always had that desire…it was the convergence of technology and the idea that statistics and results to both sports are public domain. Both of these things are sorely lacking in horse racing. What do you think: Is MLB paying someone to tabulate their scores, keep track of records? Do you think they get more back because that’s in the public domain? More people interested in their sport?
Betting on horse racing is LEGAL online or over the phone in many jurisdictions but you never see the ADW companies advertising during racing. Why?
Probably because, if you reside where I live, it’s the equivalent of being taken to the strip in Vegas and being told I can play in only one casino. Why would an ADW advertise when their restrictions and customer base are so limited by being entangled in turf wars and BS.
To me these issues mentioned in the last day or so in this thread aren’t really marketing initiatives. They’re just common sense that the industry long ago lost somewhere (did they ever really have it?)….and I hold very little hope of it ever changing really. Try explaining to a new fan why they have to pay to find results, pay to see a video of a past race, can only bet with this ADW and not the one they want…and you get the newbie looking back at you like you have to pay to see the menu in a restaurant (and, BTW, there’s only one thing on the menu after you pay to see it).

Posted by o_crunk on September 8, 2008 @ 10:00 pm

I feel silly declaring any facet the BIG problem, considering the state of the industry these days, but o_crunk brings up an issue that I think has become a major drag on racing, and that’s all the data and information and video tied up by exclusives and hidden behind paywalls. It’s tough to market this game when you force players to jump through endless hoops to get the most basic information and watch races — this is especially so when we talk about marketing racing to gamblers, and focusing more on the game. Racing can’t hold on to the people who might be the most interested if, after hooking their attention and enticing them with promises of easy wagering, intellectual stimulation, and friendly competition, the industry has to tell people this ADW carries these tracks and another those tracks, and you can watch live streaming video, but only if you have a wagering account and you wager a certain amount, and you can’t find simple historical data or get more than the most basic entries/results information without paying and paying and paying again. It’s ridiculous, when we’ve come to a point technology-wise where people expect to go to Google and find whatever they want, or download mobile apps that give them all the game information they can handle for their favorite team or sport.

Posted by Gina on September 10, 2008 @ 11:47 pm

“Cultivating 10 new 100-grand-a-year players is far more valuable than attracting 50 families who might picnic by the rail on a spring day.”
I have to disagree with that. Why are we worried about horse racing prospering in the future? We have a very limited fan base and it doesn’t seem to be growing. Is that really the way to grow it?
I agree that you can’t try to catch everyone with one net, but it does take some careful thought to target that next generation of fans, and ideally figure out who they are and how they spend entertainment dollars – rather than just giving up and saying let’s just go for high rollers.
I agree with you when you say, “Admit what you are, be proud of it, and start selling your strengths. Now.” Think about the fact that a day at the track might possibly be the greatest value there is for a family outing. That’s only one outstanding facet of the game, but just wanted to throw it out as an example of what you’d be forgetting if you went after the big fish only.

Posted by Pete on September 11, 2008 @ 10:22 am

Thanks, Pete, and I don’t disagree. I was just prioritizing what I see as the most pressing needs. Family fun and flavor along the grandstand apron ought to be part of every racetrack’s experience.

Posted by John S. on September 11, 2008 @ 10:39 am

I see – and yeah, we do need to prioritize are audience, but we also need to prioritize our messages to them, because like I said, I couldn’t agree more with you that you can’t catch them with one net.
I think it’s come up already here that “Admit what you are” is just so challenging because the game is so many things to so many people. While I think you can’t catch them all with an overarching, sweeping campaign, I do think that it’s necessary to expose people to the entire experience, meaning not just how to read the form, and not just the wagering, and not just the stretch run, but how they all come together.

Posted by Pete on September 11, 2008 @ 1:47 pm

And let’s not forget that the meets that are considered “most successful”–Saratoga, Keeneland, Del Mar–are the ones that attract the widest variety of patrons: families, young people, gamblers. No one’s looking around trying to figure out how to make other tracks more like Aqueduct, where only the hard-core show up.
To cultivate the gambler at the expense of the fan is, I think, exactly the wrong approach. The hard part of all of this is that the industry needs to successfully attract two very different audiences to the same product.

Posted by Teresa on September 11, 2008 @ 2:17 pm

oops, I meant “our” audience

Posted by Pete on September 11, 2008 @ 2:23 pm

To be clear, and maybe I wasn’t in my other posts: I think it’s great if racing can attract families and casual fans who love horses. I would love people to discover the joys and rhythms of the racetrack. That’s why I made mention of days like the Haskell, and why I think the Virginia Derby is such a great day of racing. Teresa is right — Saratoga, keeneland and Del Mar attract the widest variety of patrons. But those tracks also are in idylic upstate NY in the fall, by the sea in california, and filled to the brim with horse heaven in Kentucky. Aqueduct doesn’t have those strengths going for it. So you have to sell the strengths you have to the people who might be most inclined to fall in love with the game itself, and I just don’t see the sport doing it.

Posted by John S. on September 11, 2008 @ 4:17 pm

Which hemisphere are you in, JS? Where I come from (namely, Saratoga), July and August are summer months! =)

Posted by Teresa on September 11, 2008 @ 4:35 pm

You’re right. You’re right. I was just thinking cool, crisp beautiful upstate New York summer, and August is kind of sort of like fall up there, no? I don’t know. Just take me out behind the barn and put me down. Just make sure I don’t suffer too much.

Posted by John S. on September 11, 2008 @ 10:18 pm